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We talk with legal scholar-journalist Julia Powles who has done some deep dives into the world of Alphabet\u2019s Deep Mind\u2019s relationship with NHS data. Our conversation starts with Julia\u2019s collaborator, Hal Hodson, and his reporting on Deep Mind for the New Scientist. Julia explains the findings of the Information Commissioner and the subtle intersection of the Data Protection Act 1998 and the \u201cboot out\u201d to the Caldicott Guidelines. The relevance to the U.S. is confirmed with discussions of the \u201cfirst mover\u201d advantages in establishing data market power, the problems associated with the privatization of public health data, and the \u201ctransparency paradox\u201d associated with big data companies.