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For the first time since Episode 46, golf course architect Mike DeVries joins Andy on the podcast. DeVries was introduced to the game at Crystal Downs Golf Club in Michigan, and he worked for Tom Doak and Tom Fazio before starting his own design business. His best-known work is Cape Wickham Links on King Island in Tasmania, but he has also built several excellent, affordable public courses in his home state of Michigan. Mike and Andy discuss two of his accessible designs in the Grand Rapids area, Diamond Springs and The Mines, before speaking more broadly about the dual influences of Perry Maxwell and Alister MacKenzie, the joys of walking, and the challenges of routing courses on severe sites, such as the one where Mike\u2019s stunning Greywalls course sits.