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Listening well isn\u2019t an easy skill for most of us. We like to talk, and in a culture that values productivity and solutions above all else, simply listening can often feel like we\u2019re not being useful. Dr. Kelsey Crowe, author of There is No Good Card for This, thinks differently.\xa0\nAn empathy coach and founder of the nonprofit, Help Each Other Out, Kelsey knows a thing or two about listening\u2014making it her mission in life to teach us how to empathize in an increasingly self-centered world. On this episode of The Sidewalk Talk podcast, Traci and Kelsey laugh and listen together, talking about all things empathy, connection, and attention.\xa0\nThroughout their conversation, Kelsey shares with us her three basic rules on empathy for idiots, how we can ask for the attention we need, and the value of gestures. Especially during a season where we\u2019re dealing with more uncertainty than ever, empathy is so important\u2014not just for others, but also for ourselves. If you\u2019re looking for a practical guide to becoming a better listener, and better person and friend in the process, look no further than this dynamic and empathetic conversation between Traci and Kelsey.\xa0\n\xa0\nEpisode Milestones\n[00:07] Intro\xa0\n[02:24] Meet Kelsey\xa0\n[06:51] What Kelsey discovered about empathy\xa0\n[09:45] Kelsey\u2019s rules on empathy for idiots everywhere\xa0\n[15:09] Why it\u2019s hard for us to not be useful\xa0\n[22:23] How we ask for the attention we need\xa0\n[26:23] The value of gestures\xa0\n[31:25] What Kelsey\u2019s working on next\xa0\n[34:39] Sidewalk Talk in Germany and during COVID-19\xa0\n[37:17] Listening during conflict\xa0\n[40:26] How can we show up differently for others during COVID\xa0\n[44:55] Kelsey\u2019s wish for you\xa0\n[46:40] Outro\xa0\n\xa0\nResources Mentioned\nThere is No Good Card for This: What to say and do when life is scary, awful, and unfair to people you love\nHelp Each Other Out\nThe Empathy Bootcamp \n\xa0\nStandout Quotes from the Episode\n\u201cThe value of hearing someone else, truly hearing, cannot be underestimated.\u201d\u2014Kelsey Crowe\xa0\n\u201cIf we\u2019re thinking about how we\u2019re going to respond, we\u2019re not truly taking in what somebody\u2019s feeling.\u201d\u2014Kelsey Crowe\xa0\n\u201cWhen people are talking, they don\u2019t only want to be validated. Sometimes it\u2019s actually an opportunity for them to understand and build their experience in the course of telling it. And providing people the space to do that is tremendous.\u201d \u2014Kelsey Crowe\xa0\n\u201cWe find that listening is unproductive, that it\u2019s not useful, when it\u2019s so useful. So our definition of what\u2019s useful has to expand to include presence and attention. Attention is useful.\u201d \u2014Kelsey Crowe\xa0\n\u201cWe need to figure out more and more ways to display emotional intelligence that\u2019s beyond just how we talk to people.\u201d\u2014Kelsey Crowe\xa0\n\xa0\nConnect:\nFind | Sidewalk Talk Podcast\nAt sidewalk-talk.org\nOn Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg\nOn Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg\n\xa0\nFind | Traci Ruble\nAt Traciruble.com\nOn Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT\nOn Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT\nOn Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT