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Inbal Shani is the chief product officer at GitHub, where she leads core product management, along with product strategy, marketing, open source, and communities, including the development of GitHub Copilot. Prior to joining GitHub, she led engineering and product teams at Amazon and Microsoft.\xa0In today\u2019s conversation, we discuss:

\u2022 What Inbal believes is overhyped and underhyped in the rapidly changing field of AI

\u2022 How AI-driven code generation is changing software development

\u2022 Her take on whether AI will replace developers

\u2022 How software development looks in 3 to 5 years

\u2022 How product teams operate at GitHub

\u2022 GitHub\u2019s Next team, and other ways the company fosters a culture of innovation

\u2022 The success metrics and philosophy behind GitHub\u2019s Copilot

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Find the transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-future-of-ai-in-software-development-inbal-shani-cpo-of-github/#transcript

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Where to find Inbal Shani:

\u2022 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/inbalshani/

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Where to find Lenny:

\u2022 Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

\u2022 X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

\u2022 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Inbal\u2019s background

(04:17) Why generative AI is not going to replace developers in the near future\xa0

(05:54) Why AI-driven testing is underhyped

(07:48) What the next 3 to 5 years will look like

(10:13) Stats around the use of GitHub Copilot\xa0

(12:07) How Copilot enables engineers to work more efficiently

(13:38) Common mistakes when adopting AI into your workflows

(16:42) How GitHub operationalizes \u201cdogfooding\u201d

(18:46) The philosophy behind Copilot

(20:24) Copilot\u2019s success metrics

(24:54) How Copilot encourages collaboration

(26:37) What we lose when AI writes code for us

(29:35) A retrospective on the generative AI space

(30:47) Inbal\u2019s thoughts on the future of AI

(32:35) How to make space for innovative product ideas

(34:37) How GitHub stays on the cutting edge of innovation

(36:44) The GitHub Next team

(39:20) Advice for early product managers

(42:17) Inbal\u2019s \u201cbiggest learning\u201d from her career

(45:34) Inbal\u2019s closing thoughts

(46:19) Lightning round

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Referenced:

\u2022 How to measure and improve developer productivity | Nicole Forsgren (Microsoft Research, GitHub, Google): https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-measure-and-improve-developer-productivity-nicole-forsgren-microsoft-research-github-goo/

\u2022 DORA: https://dora.dev/

\u2022 The role of AI in product development | Ryan J. Salva (VP of Product at GitHub, Copilot): https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-role-of-ai-in-new-product-development-ryan-j-salva-vp-of-product-at-github-copilot/

\u2022 GitHub Universe 2023 day 2 keynote: The productivity platform for all developers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_o9kFPVeiw

\u2022 Satya Nadella on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/satyanadella/

\u2022 TomTom: https://www.tomtom.com/

\u2022 Failing Forward: Turning Mistakes into Stepping Stones for Success: https://www.amazon.com/Failing-Forward-Turning-Mistakes-Stepping/dp/0785288570/

\u2022 Good to Great: Why Some Companies Make the Leap and Others Don\u2019t: https://www.amazon.com/Good-Great-Some-Companies-Others/dp/0066620996

\u2022 Turning the Flywheel: A Monograph to Accompany Good to Great: https://www.amazon.com/Turning-Flywheel-Monograph-Accompany-Great/dp/0062933795

\u2022 Dare to Lead Like a Girl: How to Survive and Thrive in the Corporate Jungle: https://www.amazon.com/Dare-Lead-Like-Girl-Corporate/dp/1538163527

\u2022 All the Light We Cannot See on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81083008

\u2022 The Wheel of Time on Amazon Prime: https://www.amazon.com/Wheel-Time-Season-1/dp/B09F59CZ7R

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.