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Nilan Peiris is Chief Product Officer at Wise, one of the fastest-growing (and profitable) tech companies in the world. Wise allows anyone to send money in more than 60 currencies to over 160 countries at low cost, and throughout its history has grown primarily through word of mouth. In today\u2019s episode, we discuss:

\u2022 Tactical advice on driving word of mouth (WOM)

\u2022 Strategies for measuring WOM

\u2022 How NPS surveys helped Wise determine their growth and product strategy

\u2022 How Wise incentivizes teams to do the hard things

\u2022 The small change that generated a 3x increase in referrals

\u2022 How Wise structures its product and growth teams

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Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-drive-word-of-mouth-nilan

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Where to find Nilan Peiris:

\u2022 Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/nilanp

\u2022 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nilanpeiris/

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Where to find Lenny:

\u2022 Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

\u2022 Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

\u2022 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Nilan\u2019s background

(03:27) A brief overview of Wise

(06:11) How word of mouth is measured

(07:56) Why Wise leaned into WOM

(10:21) Why Wise built their WOM motion using the NPS method

(16:13) How WOM solves trust problems

(18:55) How to get to 9 or 10 on the NPS scale

(20:51) Determining what will wow users

(21:31) Common missteps companies make when trying to drive WOM

(23:24) Using the \u201cworking backward\u201d method at Airbnb

(25:45) How Wise is able to offer drastically lower money transfer fees

(27:51) The three costs associated with moving money

(32:02) Rational vs. irrational reasons behind recommendations

(34:11) Prioritizing customer happiness

(38:14) How Wise approaches experimentation

(46:11) Thoughts on performance reviews and general analysis

(48:06) How Wise provides a 10x better banking experience

(51:57) Advice on how to approach word-of-mouth marketing

(53:47) Building a culture of doing hard things

(55:59) The macrostructure of international banking and where Wise fits in

(57:54) How Wise solves for local regulations in their onboarding flow

(1:01:49) How Wise structures teams

(1:03:26) The small change that generated a 3x increase in referrals

(1:08:01) Nilan\u2019s philanthropic endeavors

(1:09:13) Lightning round

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Referenced:

\u2022 Wise: https://wise.com/us/

\u2022 Henry Chen on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/henry-h-chen/

\u2022 About NPS: https://www.productboard.com/blog/the-power-of-nps-in-your-product-strategy/

\u2022 How Snow White helped Airbnb prove that storytelling is the most important skill in design: https://uxdesign.cc/how-airbnb-proved-that-storytelling-is-the-most-important-skill-in-design-15d04ac71039

\u2022 Seth Godin: This Is How You Create a Remarkable Product: https://www.businessinsider.com/seth-godin-this-is-how-you-create-a-remarkable-product-2012-10

\u2022 Discover the Spotify model: https://www.atlassian.com/agile/agile-at-scale/spotify

\u2022 Beam: https://beam.org/

\u2022 Affinity: https://affinityghana.com/

\u2022 Crime and Punishment: https://www.amazon.com/Crime-Punishment-Volokhonsky-Translation-Classics/dp/0679734503

\u2022 Midnight\u2019s Children: https://www.amazon.com/Midnights-Children-Modern-Library-Novels/dp/0812976533

\u2022 Barbie: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1517268/

\u2022 Arc browser: https://arc.net/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.