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Chris McCann is a tech business and thought leader specializing in helping successful people and companies remember who they are and align their life with their purpose. After many years of professional striving at the expense of personal development, he awakened to the need to cultivate an inner life. Chris charted a new course prioritizing professional achievement led by personal meaning by studying the world\\u2019s great spiritual texts, training with prominent spiritual leaders, and developing the tools required to navigate life and find real purpose. Today, he manages several ventures that help others find their meaning and purpose, including coaching clients one-on-one, building Scale-Up sales teams, providing corporate consulting on conscious leadership, and facilitating retreats.

Connect with Chris: https://chrismccann.co/

Unknown Speaker 0:00
Your journey has been an interesting one up to hear you've questioned so much more than those around you. You've even questioned yourself as to how you could have grown into these thoughts. Am I crazy? When did I begin to think differently? Why do people in general, here's so limited,

Brandon Handley 0:12
spiritual dope, I'm on here today with Chris McCann. He is a tech business and thought leader, especially especially thought leader, specializing and helping successful people and companies remember who they are and align their life with their purpose. After many years of professional striving at the expense of personal development, he awakened to the need to cultivate an inner life. Chris chartered a new course prioritizing Professional Achievement led by personal meaning by studying the world's great spiritual texts, training with prominent spiritual leaders and developing the tools required to navigate life and find real purpose. Today, he manages several ventures that help others find their meaning and purpose, including coaching clients, one on one, building skill up sales teams, providing corporate consulting, conscious leadership and facilitating retreats. Sorry, because I got tripped up there a little bit. We're saying. So I'll tell you right now, I took me a second to remember, Chris and I were going back and forth before it's got started, how we got connected. And I wanted to connect with you because because I'm in I'm in the same space, as you as matter of fact. So I'm in the technology space have been now for about over 12 years now. Right? And, and what you're talking about really resonates with me, you know, how do we find purpose and like this? This daily grind, right? How do we wake up every day and be like, what I'm doing today is helping somebody somewhere, and is aligned with me spiritually, somehow, right? Like, shit, man, how do we make that happen? Right. So that's, and I was like, I was like, Yeah, let's have this conversation. I think that'd be cool. So that's happy to have you on here today, Chris. I usually like to start these off the whole idea that you and I are, what are we? What are we we are conduits for spiritual, universal energy. Chris, whatever's coming through us today is going to somebody on the other end of this listening in, and there's a message that can only be delivered through you to that person. What's that message today, Chris?

Chris McCann 2:18
Shut up and get out of your own way. You know, there's, it's really interesting, and thanks for having me on. It's a real pleasure, I love just talking shop and, and connecting with folks. So there's, I'll put a big, fat asterisk on the end of that, which implies that I could be wrong about all of this. So if, if I, if I ever tell you that I've got it all figured out, and emails, come over to my house and just, you know, walk me off into the nearest plot of land. It's, you know, it's interesting to think about organizations and our role in it. And you and I were talking about this a little bit ahead of hitting the record button. And I'm really fortunate to work for a technology company that has a great product. Like we literally get people promoted when they adopt our platform. And you know, and go into production with it. It's it's a content management platform. And, you know, various sales roles that I've had throughout my career, whether I've been doing technology recruiting, whether I've been pushing stocks and bonds or working in bond us for Morgan Stanley Dean Witter way back when trying to borrow the car from my parents, you know, and everything in my life has been a sales job in one way, shape, or form or another. And to have some form of meaning attached to what we do on a daily basis, if we don't own our own enterprise is absolutely critical. When I think of how we can make an impact, right, and it's different when you're working for a small startup, as opposed to working for a fortune 50 or fortune 100 company where you can literally become, you know, you know, badge number 13,743 That happens. And, you know, how do we then ascribe meaning, or find meaning in what we're doing on a daily basis, because, particularly with the pandemic, Brandon, you know, the the concept of work life balance, which in my mind has always been a fallacy, but those lines are blurred even further, when all of a sudden for those of us that are married or in relationship or have children or even grandchildren, we all of a sudden found ourselves surrounded by co workers that were anywhere from 12 inches high to you know, our grandparents. And so those lines became very blurred and how do you then go from an office or you know, commuting into working from home and you're a able to perform this sort of integration. And so a lot of the work that I've been able to do with people, whether it's my team internally at my company, or working with other organizations or individuals has been distilling the mission, right, and whether it's a mission statement on a 10k for an organization, or it's something that the founders come up with, and then looking for adjectives that you know, a shared interest or a common ground between myself as an employee, and the broader organization. And it's a lot less about, you know, I want to be this when I grow up, but what are the adjectives that really energize us as people? And what can I do more of that at least leave me in a place where I don't feel completely depleted, but I feel replenished. And that's been a really interesting exercise for myself and the folks that work with me and the folks that I've worked for, as well as my private clients.

Brandon Handley 6:02
That's awesome. I mean, I want to bring them up to one thing, yeah, it's great. I read a little bit of backstory, right. So you started off and you didn't start off like in like, you know, some of these fortune 500 companies, you start off as in, you know, a family owned Bread Company, which I think is really cool, too, right. And so you grew up kind of work and doing the daily grind, and you propelled yourself and you work, you kept working, right? You just kept this like really strong work ethic, and has a lot of success in the Fortune 500. And I think that, you know, look, if you grind yourself out, especially with youthful energy, right? As a youth, you can make a lot of things happen. He made a lot of things happen. And then at a certain point, you know, you ran into some of these things that you're talking about, right? This work life balance and kind of looking for it and realizing a it's kind of a fallacy, and then I'm gonna fast forward into the fact that hey, work life balance in the pandemic sucks, man, that was awful. Still kind of awful, right? It's still kind of going on. I talked about it at home right now I work from home, and I've got my two children. They were home with us for the first year. And even now, it's kind of like, it's, it's like, I feel approachable sometimes. Because, yeah, I'm over here at my desk anytime on my desk, like my wife's, like, you know, don't go in and bother dad, he's working, but like, I'm like, I'd rather they come in and bother me, then. You know, whatever's on the phone. Chances are? I mean, I'm not saving lives today with what I'm doing. Like, I'm not like, like, I'm not in the middle of surgery. Right. And I think that I think that, I think that a lot of people, as you probably saw during the pandemic, they realized, you know, where they had the opportunity to rejigger their their their stuff, right? Like, how do we, you know, what, what's what is important to me? Right? So I guess it'd be really curious to see kind of what you saw, like, in the past couple years, and where, where people are at, right? And distilling this mission and working towards becoming more replenished. I'm trying to think of the Strength Finders, there was a standout 2.0 is Marcus Buckingham Yeah, yeah, that's what you reminded me of, and thinking of that, as a great series, right? In that kind of what you're doing and having people focus more on their strengths, where they can go and leverage their strengths. And at the end of the day, they actually feel replenished, because they gave to the company versus something was extracted from them?

Chris McCann 8:25
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, so I had this conversation. Two weeks ago, when I was interviewing a candidate, and in the high tech space for an organization to all of a sudden shut their doors in this market means that something went very, very wrong very, very fast. And so I found myself and my first trade show in two and a half years in Las Vegas as a shop talk for that that was in and out, but the day before fast as an organization existed, two days later, after receiving 100 million plus in funding, they shut the door. And so a lot of really talented people found themselves out on the street, you know, overnight. And, you know, there's one gentleman that I interviewed that I really would love to hire, however, the role that we have opened isn't the right role for him and so we spend a lot of time talking about this. And what I love about marquee Marcus Buckingham programs and particularly with standout is that weaknesses are weaknesses for a reason. Right? And just because you have no interest in them, or you want to ignore them and being able to minimize them, but when I found myself ran into my we'll call it mid 30s. So I was two children that were teenagers at that point, and you're struggling to pay bills and trying to figure out life just wasn't working for me. Right and Nevermind the love affair that I was I had with vodka at the time to in every realize as I was approaching 40, that I had to do something different. And so I pulled this is when Seinfeld was a very relevance, you know, television program. So I pulled the Costanza and I decided to do the exact opposite of everything I had been doing to get better results. And it sounds like you've also participated in a lot of programs around self discovery. So it's anything from birds Meyer to stand out to the Enneagram, etc, right? Anything.

Brandon Handley 10:34
I'm looking for who I am, right, like, I'm like, I haven't figured it out. I need like, 70 Fucking books to figure it out. I'm like, I don't even know man. Like, because real similar to you, right? You know, got it, you get up to a certain point. And you're like, man, I've been working really hard. What have I even been doing with myself? And who am I like I've been doing everything people told me I should be doing. And for some reason, I'm still kind of stagnant and I'm still unfulfilled. Yeah.

Chris McCann 11:01
So hell, I was 23 or 22. And I house mortgage, I never finished college check. I barely started and I spent more time doing my radio show, and I did anything else. And I did all the things that I thought I was supposed to. And that's just how I was raised to your point. I mean, being the the child of two generations removed from a gentleman who came over from Poland to start a bakery. If nothing else, I knew how to work hard. But like the movie Christmas vacation when Clark is out there in his front yard, and he's you know, getting ready to display the lights in front of his in laws. And he gets out there in he's like Joy to the world. And goes to connect those connectors and nothing happens. The mother in law scoffs Audrey, his daughter looks at him or looks at the mother in law and says, you know, you've worked really hard on that. And the grandfather says, so did washing machines, and I don't want to be a washing machine. I'm gonna work smart. And so, you know, in this in this mid 30s, like, turn about because you'll hear oftentimes in these programs or reading books, like whatever you did when you're eight years old, is how you should spend your time today. But fuck, like is collecting baseball cards gonna put my kids through college is me sitting in the basement sketching or drawing or, you know, writing poetry or whatever, is that going to move the needle for my family? And like, no, so I started to really focus on the adjectives. So I love to create if I wanted to play volleyball, but in the middle of Michigan, there weren't any volleyball teams in the winter for men or boys. So I started our own volleyball team and intramural sports coaching, leading coaching my my brothers and sisters teams, writing and I loved advanced analytics. I was, it was like crunching numbers on the back of baseball cards, and I was a kid that's like, well, these are the things that I would do in my basement, when I get into that flow state where I lose track of time. If I can at least look for these adjectives and the role that I'm in today, right, where I feel empowered and on purpose, and is that I'm part of something that's bigger than myself. Maybe that'll work. Right? And it did. Right? And you know, today and it's it's funny how when we get out of our own way, and we do things that come naturally to us, or that we have a proclivity for where life isn't as hard, there's not as much resistance, you don't have to fight it, and you can be in the flow.

Brandon Handley 13:37
Right. Chris, real quick, do you mind? For somebody that might not be familiar with flow state? Right? I know that you and I, we've been like, we're so deep in it, right? Like you would like flow. I know exactly what you're saying. But somebody's missing, even though I've shared it on every podcast, probably as well. But this could be the first one that they ever listened to. So flow state, what does that mean to you? And you know, that that

Chris McCann 14:01
flow state for me is when I just lose track of the concept that we call time when I'm doing something that just feels right, and feel is the operative word there, right? Where and you've had perhaps meditations or perhaps you've done some sort of plant medicine where you begin to at least have a reference point as time being a construct as opposed to something that actually exists. And if there's one thing that the listener that your audience has done in their lives where time slowed down, that feeling becomes a reference points and you can start to lean into an explore more of what's available to you. Where you feel in the zone, you know, it's in perhaps it's because you're playing softball on the softball all of a sudden looks like a watermelon and you couldn't not hit it. These moments are few and far between but they're provided to us to help us Remember, our true nature? And we are on purpose?

Brandon Handley 15:06
Yeah, man, I love that. And you're using these words like, you know, empowered on purpose. Other words like integration? Are these some of the words that you're bringing into the companies to get people to kind of charge? And again, would you say here kind of feel more replenished? This is the stuff that you have in there.

Chris McCann 15:26
It is. And you know, a lot of it is really intuitive. Brendon? You know, I don't, I've been on the receiving end, there have been a victim of a lot of motivational speeches in my professional career, right? What I want to know is, what's the one or two things that I can take away and actually implement or use in my daily life? Right, I don't need a guy coming in from a van down by the river rolling into our office or going into our high school auditorium, telling me about the perils of alcohol, or anything like that. I want something tangible, and something that I can use. And it's one thing for someone to tell you or for someone to tell me what the answer is, but anything that's sticky, anything that creates lasting change in my life, has been because I've had a realization, then perhaps someone shed a light on it, someone illuminated for me, but until I can experience it and make it my own, it's not going to stick. So I like to think that whether it's me as a sales leader with my 12 direct reports, or it's me working with organizations, I like to think that I can help them find their own answers, you know, there's really three layers to that, and whether it's, you know, at home with my family or at work or working with, you know, individuals, somebody can come to you, you know, and as a as a frontline manager, and you and your coaching, right, and this applies to the work that you do, and the work that I do, where you're you're basically saying, Okay, here's the play that we're going to run, right. And there's the teaching aspect as well and where you're teaching them the fundamentals of how to be coached. So I'm going to teach you how to do a crossover dribble to use a sports analogy, but this is part of a broader plan. And it's that's the, the coaching the teaching aspect. But when the rubber hits the road, and we're lasting change begins, is when people will come to you for advice. The flip side of that is then being vulnerable enough on my side as a man and as a human who has a lot more questions than I do answers. And being open to receiving advice. You know, one of the things that you had mentioned around, you know, this journey of being a baker, although to where I am today, my father in law, and I sat down last week, and we were back in the Midwest for spring break. And, you know, he's said to be my goodness, 78. Self Made, put himself through Harvard, hardscrabble, Ohio guy, you know, he still drives what, uh, Billy Corrigan's Ferraris around, you know, he's just a really interesting guy. And we're having dinner and he looked at me across the table and was like, you know, Chris, can I can I offer something to you? And I don't want you to take it out of context. Absolutely. He's like, you're a Put me in coach sort of guy. He was like, Okay, tell me more. He's like, you're Put me in coach guy, like, just put me in and I'm going to figure it out. He's like, look at what you've done just in the, you know, 12 years since I've known you. And he's like, but that's not a bad thing. Chris, he's like, I'm the same way. He's like, You Put me in coach, I'm gonna figure it out. And I'm gonna do it right, I'm gonna do it well, how do you know what's not happening around you? Or what is happening around you? And it's like, well, tell me more. He's like, Well, how do you know, because like, you have a lot riding on content stack, you have a lot invested, you have a lot of options that are on the table, and there's no guarantee that those options are going to be worth anything, you know, when you're fully vested in 14 months. So my question to you, Chris, is, how are you going to make yourself more aware of what's going on around you? And I had to sleep on it. So the next morning, I woke up and I was like, I got it. Like, I have my own internal board of directors, Brandon, and I have a nutritionist.

A fantastic general practitioner. I had a strength and conditioning coach when I was competing. I have spiritual teachers. I have everything except for this business camp. And I'm in I'm in a frontier here. I've never been part of a post Series B organization with tall direct reports. It's working its way toward an IPO. I don't have have access to the Board of Directors weren't sitting in on meetings any longer. So I'm actively searching for a mentor who has done this and then where I've been. Now. This is me as a 49 year old man. If it were five years ago, that would I've been open to that sort of advice, would I have been vulnerable, vulnerable enough or willing to listen to someone as opposed to being a puppy and coach, certainly guy. Like, I wanted to be able to turn to Him and receive that sort of guidance and advice, and kind of hack my own professional development. Like, why would I not listen to someone who's a septuagenarian and pull up is absolutely critical. And that's really part of listening and feeling it and I'm very grateful that he was able to share that with anyone out there wants to be my mentor, I'll take it.

Brandon Handley 20:57
Well, you know, it's funny, you bring it up, right, like, so. I wrote down, I always do this, right. So there's a, I don't know if it's, I think it's national. But so it's called the service corps of Retired Executives. Right. My grandfather was a member of that. And, you know, this is a group of people, you know, retired executives, I don't know what else to tell you. Right? That it's an organization that helps people in business, right. They've been there, they've been there. I think one of the things that we do such a shitty job of is like, Listen, don't get me wrong, like anybody younger than us full of the van vitality and vigor, disruptive, all this other stuff, we completely neglect everybody that's gone ahead of us. We're like, well, you know, they can't even work an iPhone. So what the hell would they know? Right? But, you know, just because they can't work in iPhone doesn't mean like, I don't know, let's look at marketing over the past 100 years, marketing hasn't changed, the application of the marketing has changed, like, where you put your billboard up has changed. Right, the rest of it is all the same. Same thing with business. Same thing with a lot of this other stuff. I think that a lot of that's the same. And so I think the story that you tell is really cool, though, you know, you're looking to somebody that's been there before I did this very disciplined, very similar. My my father in law. Geez, I think I was still drinking. So beyond five years ago. That's how it mark time. Before After drink. So he and I were, we were sitting, we were sitting down. And um, you know, he's a great guy. And I don't think too many people, you know, talk with just have a real conversation with them, right? Just kind of like heart to heart. And I said, you know, what, Mr. Clark? I was like, what would you have done? Different? What looking back? What What would you have done different? You know, he was very successful in his own right. And throughout his own life, he goes, I would have spent more time my family. I mean, that was it. Right? I guess that was enough for me. And so like, you know, a lot of the things that I've done, you know, I always go back to that in my head. You know, just, it was a 10 minute conversation, but was very impactful, right, to being able to, again, look to the people that have been there before you man, like, one way or another. So I think it's a great story. And I love the you know, Put me in coach guy, right? Like, I mean, you go in, you jump in you go do it, right. And you're gonna do whatever it takes us what I'm hearing here, and you say, right to do it right to it. Well, I love the thing to like, and you've got it on your website. So you don't have all the answers. You've learned how to ask better questions, right? You're doing all this through, let's also just reiterate this issue, kind of a spiritual, I guess, you know, maybe there's an awakening. And you let's hit on that for a second. Where's this? Where does that hit you? Right? And tell me a little bit about that.

Chris McCann 23:43
You built everything. I didn't know that things weren't possible growing up. Right. And it's not because we had everything handed to us. It's just I think that's just how I came flying out of my mother's womb, like Life is one big grand adventure. And one of my board of directors tells me and reinforces that I chose the Super Deluxe premium package when I came into this lifetime because I've got all the experiences. And, and I say that because I know there's so much more out there. And it was what may 5 of 1990 I remember this distinctly and the context of this is a little bit different today than it was when I remembered this happening to me. I was what 16, maybe 17 years old, just turned 17 And I had gone out on a date with my girlfriend, and just wasn't feeling it. And I you know, I'm gonna take you home. I just want to spend some time by myself. And it will happen to be the fifth year anniversary of my paternal grandmother passed away at the age of 59. And so I guess I was what 12 And she had passed. And at some point you During that night, I remember seeing a light come in the window, whether it was dreaming or what actually happened. It's all fantastical storytelling, I don't know. But definitely impactful. And as this light, came in through this tiny window is like straight out of a Disney movie, and then sat on the end of my bed. And I sat up automatically. And it was my grandmother's voice. So that wasn't her form. And she's like, Chris, I'll always love you always be here when you need me. And how could you feel like I didn't love you. And then I remember a dialogue happening, although the words were are forgotten, but certainly felt this went on for some time. Now, the next morning, I woke up, I felt amazing, I had completely forgotten about the experience. And then halfway through the day, I was like, Oh, my God, this actually happened. And that was the first reference point I had of this otherness that existed. And then, of course, it was 1920, Married kids drinking divorce, 15 years of Clooney in it and trying to figure it all out. And I had lost sight of this, this otherness, or perhaps a truer nature of reality, to be followed by lunch in Chicago with a friend of mine, and we were talking about spirituality and religion. And, you know, it's a couple of, you know, old school Chicago sales guys getting together over lunch. And the conversation quickly pivoted. And he's like, you know, Chris, I don't know if you're familiar with this. But there's something called the Akashic records. I learned this from this woman here in Chicago, and she's like a grandmother. And, you know, she'll give me advice. And I learned how to do this, you know, sort of reading and tuning in. And for him to say that, to me, really struck me now, you know, how these things work. Three days later, and back in Santa Monica, I go into our local yoga studio, and the owner says, Hey, Chris, you might be interested in this event, but we have this woman, Helen coming in, and she's doing Akashic Records readings, and I thought you'd be interested. And I was like, who am I to say no. And, you know, it's I leaned into that. And that was my first experience, you know, sitting around with someone who's got these psychic medium capabilities. And Brandon, you know, I'm hard charging type a charismatic. And, of course, I had something to do, I had something more important to do, as I had already arranged to be able to leave early, right, because I had to get my son to his doctor appointment. And she's like, Well, Chris, and there's six or seven other people sitting around. And she was like, you know, Chris, I know that you have to leave early. So if you want to go first, by all means, go ahead. So, you know, we're sitting in a circle. And I looked at Helen, who's a very dear friend, you know, at this point in our lives, and it says, Well, here's the deal, like, everything's coming up roses, like I was sleeping on a couch, and picking up cigarette butts off the sidewalk, you know, so many years ago, and now I live near the beach in Santa Monica. I have a beautiful wife, beautiful family, and my kids are great. I want to know, how do we take advantage of all this momentum? Right, like what else is out there? And she looked at me and then Brandon, everything just slid away. And it was just as if it were her and I in the room. She's like, Chris, the first thing you need to know is how proud they all our view and where you are right now.

And it's like, wow, it was just like dead on. And I remember getting into the car because my wife picked me up or taking their son to see his doctor. She was like, What happened to you? And I'm usually not at a loss for words. So I fired my psychotherapist. Right, because What's past is prologue and I started leaning into, you know, my time with Helen. And eventually I was like, you know, I think I'm supposed to learn how to do this. Chris, I have been waiting for you to ask me, you know that in so she taught me how to access the records. And then I spent a couple of years being fascinated with that modality and all of a sudden you have the answer, and you want to help everyone. It's like, Come to me, I'll help you with your masters, teachers and loved ones and we're gonna figure out life together. And this concept of awakening is ever evolving. And I'd like to think that I've removed a lot of the self fascination from it. And as my dear friend and teacher Carlos says, he's like, keep on truckin. Right. It's like, what's behind that? What's behind that and what's behind that? So the reality is that, I don't know. Because part of this awakening that is constantly folding and unfolding and unfolding. I don't know how it all works. And I'm not fascinated by it. Either, if to your earlier point, if I'm getting out of the way, and a clear vessel for source or spirit or the creator, or whatever it is to move through and be of service, then that's all I need to know. And it takes a lot of the pressure off and having to perform you feel like that monkey with a right acid Brookfield Zoo.

Brandon Handley 30:26
No, not for sure, for sure. And it's really cool. First of all, right? Like, I love the, the idea of, you're 16 you're sitting on the bed, you've got your Twinkle, twinkle, little star moment happening. Right? And, and, and then, you know, 20 years goes by give or take, right, like, I'm just using round numbers. And I just, I just wonder if, you know, and this is just a kind of a theory, in my mind, we've got this window of opportunity that presents itself, right, kind of like the call of the hero, Joseph Campbell stuff, right? Like, in our late teens, right, we've got this call to the spiritual space. And I want to because I had something similar, right? Like, I think I was like, 19 my might have been more drug induced, but that's okay. There's like, yeah, there's like this, this calling this like, just kind of this, this huge pool. And, and like, you know, I remember leaning into a little bit then and telling people and be like, Yeah, I think I was meant to, like, go kind of, like, you know, do do spirituality, where can people give you like, the crazy eyes, you know, like, keep off in this car, right. 20 years goes by for you. So I always wonder about like, this kind of window of opportunity. And like, you know, if we if we let it pass, and like, we're, we've got to spend the next 20 years grinding the fuck out. Right? So we got to go there. So it's an interesting thought, I'll let you know out there. Maybe you can tell me your kids or sounds like they're older now. Right? Like and just definitely be curious to hear if they've kind of experienced anything like that for themselves. But then I also love that, you know, you're sitting there, you're having you're having lunch, right? And I love that like, seems to me, these spiritual conversations are happening more in our work lives. Right? As this is a professional company, I'm guessing this professional meeting, right? Not a couple of you guys haven't, you know, tried to figure out like, what the next what are the next steps? Chris, what's the next step?

You know, bringing up the Kashuk records, and you're like, I don't know where and then and then as you said, right, you know, what happens next? Of course, the universe is like, well, first seems like he's interested, let's present it to him. And

Chris McCann 32:40
yeah, totally, totally. It's, it's really interesting, for sure.

Brandon Handley 32:46
So you're doing this work, right? Not nine, like you're you're doing your day job. But it seems like you're also bringing this type of thought process and modality to other businesses and companies as a speaker. What a facilitator can tell us a little bit about the work that you're doing that brings us to corporations and sales teams.

Chris McCann 33:09
It was really by accident. So as part of my leaning into being a Spiritual Activist, and you know, wanting to bring the Akashic records or psychic mediumship or crystals and incense to the masses, I had created this either or mechanism in my head was like, Okay, I'm going to put down being a successful sales leader, I'm going to lean into just doing as many $200 An hour sessions as I possibly can, because I want to be able to help people. And, you know, that went on for some time, but I just, I wasn't able to really find a lot of traction with it, or even for that matter, satisfaction, because, you know, it felt like people were coming with really the same questions. And I'm sure this is true for you as well. It's, why can't I find my life partner or my relationship sucks, and that I don't have an interest necessarily, and just focusing on that, like, my, my client base at the time was 82% of women and 18% men, like where's my life partner? And, you know, sitting with Carlos represented again, and he's just a beautiful guy. And as a quote, how do I make this change? Like, how do I actually go from this to this? And he's like, you're doing at work, dumbass.

Brandon Handley 34:35
What's the what's the this to this that you're trying to achieve? Right?

Chris McCann 34:39
And how do I how do I move from you know, like, grinding away as a sales guy to just being of service to people to help him and he's so as Kevin was, you're doing it and I was like, oh my god, like I have so many awkward keynote is in front of me, you know, to bring these worlds together, right and to where I can play at work and be well compensated for it. That's the deal structure. Okay. But then someone today that's an executive in the company called because they just wanted some advice on something else. If you don't know where you're going to be able to be of service, and this idea of linearity between if I do this, this is the result? Well, no, I know that, you know, as an example, if I do this and make myself available to serve this other mechanism, a company might just say, Hey, Chris, we're gonna give you 10,000 More options because of this. So there's, it's not a direct transaction, right? Yeah,

Brandon Handley 35:43
it talks about that. Right? The whole idea of us looking for linearity, because the story works on a timeline and a straight line in our mind. I think that, you know, linearity does exist in once we begin to apply spirituality and or other, you know, talk to me about that. What do you see, ya

Chris McCann 36:03
know, I feel like it just integrates. Well, no, it frustrates my wife to know. And

Brandon Handley 36:11
I want to, I want to find out about all this stuff, too. Right.

Chris McCann 36:15
Yeah. So she loves to listen to these podcasts and, and hold me accountable for what I put out there. And that, you know, these timelines are really slippery. Right? And, and even if we're going to consider the idea of past lives, whether it's true or not, no idea, it's been my experience that there's something to it. But even then, it's not like because I when I would do past life regressions on myself, it was like, Well, how can I be in multiple timelines at once? Like, how can this be true for me, and like 1963. And this is true for me in 1959, but they're radically different experiences and radically different places. And what I've come to understand is, it's a lot like a DVD, or you throw it in there, and you're able to skip chapters, and there's some fluidity moving back and forth. But the movie Interstellar, right? So I love for these things to be underpinned by science as much as possible. Right? Right, right. And when we look at the movie Interstellar, and how you can go into space, and then you find yourself on a planet, where you might be on that planet for 15 minutes, but 40 to 50 years is passed, when you're 60,000 feet or, you know, whatever it might be above the planet, the science supports, that time is a construct. And if it is, in fact, a construct, you know, do we get to play with this non linearity? When we put expectations on things, and this is also like, you know, what's the purpose of life, you know, it then it has to be transactional. And even though that's our understanding, as a human This is storytelling and this is really organized religion and governments and others telling us that there has to be this framework around this to make sense of I'm firmly convinced brand and and that, you know, all the great spiritual leaders, whether it's a Mohammed in a cave drinking Ayahuasca, or is Jesus run off to the desert for 40 days, you know, these folks went out, they had some sort of a psychedelic experience, they come back and then someone puts a church around it, or a mosque or a temple. You know, it's like the profit is equal. This sounds like a really crazy trip to me. And

Brandon Handley 38:29
when no doubt, right, no doubt, and I think anytime you take some Texas over 2000 years old, some things are gonna get lost in translation, quite literally. And that's, that's kind of the thing I always, I always even like, look at the number 4040 days and 40 nights or whatever is more than yours. I mean, because look at you and I right now and the age of 40. I was really great. Man's really great YouTube, I forget who Rupert Sheldrake maybe, does, like, you know, life begins at 40. Right, and it's like it really, for me, it's really turned a corner, right, right around 40 and just turned into something so much. I don't know. Different, better cooler? I don't know.

Chris McCann 39:11
Yeah, it's talking to a neighbor of mine the other day, she's 82 years old, and her her partner passed away. You know, he was a curator at the Oakland Museum of Art. And she's had a really hard time because they've been together for 60 some odd years. And she's fascinating, fascinating lady, and it's taken time for us to get to know her. She's pretty, you know, pretty closed off in a lot of ways. But we were talking on the front porch the other day, and she brought this beautiful sage plant over for for us. And we were talking about aging parents and what she's going through and she's like, you know, Chris, like as we get older, you know, ideally, we pick up a little bit of wisdom along the way. But not everybody does. Right. And, you know, it did me Again, for me around 38 You know, my 29 year old son and I were out for a walk the other day when I was back in the Midwest, and he looked at me, and he's like, you know, dad, he's like, they say that people can't change. He's like, but you're dead. He's like, look at you.

Brandon Handley 40:22
Man. How's that?

Chris McCann 40:25
Beautiful focus. We're connecting. Like, I mean, I had him when I was 19. Right? Yeah. So easy. He's like, he's like, Dad, he's like, we kind of grew up together. And as he's gotten older, and he has his first child, there's a different context, much like our experience with our own parents, you know, when we became parents. And it's like, you know, holding, it's not that I changed. But everything that I had hoped was possible when I was a kid is ad infinitum. And so it really feels more like I remembered who I am.

Brandon Handley 41:02
Yeah, yep, yep. Yep, yep. Yep. I love it. Yep. True story. Good stuff. Man. It's really cool that you got to experience that with, you do a couple of other things, too. I want to hit on real high level ones. I was just checking out your Instagram for a second. Tell me about the quantum field trips. What's that all about?

Chris McCann 41:26
It's the quantum I forgot about this post. So this was, you know, again, underpinned by science. But you know, I'll oftentimes lead this getting groups together. And it's not stumped a psychic, but it's helping people find their own answers. And so as we're beginning to understand that consciousness, in fact, could have some underpinnings of quantum theory. In fact, there was a report that came out today with a University of Alberta. But they've noticed in these tubes, in plants and in people, that light disperses differently. And when you apply an anesthetic than they perceive it, this gap could actually be where consciousness exists. And I know it's a mouthful, and it's a lot to consider. But like, how do you then use these tools, these ancient technologies of meditation or breath work, or just tuning into yourself, to be able to intuit what's true. And so what we'll do for the first 30 minutes is talk a little bit about the science that underpins this, and then I'll have people work with each other, to be able to start to help people find their own answers. They're fantastic. We do them actually all over the country. And we certainly do them in our backyard. And again, giving people tools to be able to find their own answers is where I find the most joy, right? Because I know he

Brandon Handley 42:54
loves something, let's talk about that real quick, do not do not turn up, right, like we talked about, like practical, tangible things, right. And a lot of times like we're have you and I are having a great conversation, but it's definitely very high level, right? So what is like a practical tool or two that somebody like you're talking about right now. They're challenged in life. And they they what are some tools that you offer them.

Chris McCann 43:15
So what I love to be able to do is connect with folks. And what we oftentimes do is find that one moment where it's either have significant trauma, or they felt the most connected, and will begin to on Earth, how and where they feel that as men that are in the body as men in our 40s, we oftentimes turn off our feelings

Brandon Handley 43:41
turned off at like eight man, come on now.

Chris McCann 43:43
Everything moves directly down into the root chakra. And what I've noticed in working with men is that we don't allow ourselves to feel. And so because I love working with with fellows that are in a similar situation to myself, is noticing where in the body this is in developing a discipline. And that can feel like a dirty word. But discipline to me is really listening. And developing the discipline to listen to where in your body feels most connected to what's true for you. And this can be done over the course of three minutes. It can be done over the course of you know, a couple of hours. But it's an intuitive exercise and will surface up something that's going to resonate. And women at least give you a runner. So as you go into your next meeting, or you go into your next day, where if your spidey senses off about something, where do I feel that in my body, and then we start to develop a muscle memory around? Well, if I listen to this part of my intuition, and not over intellectualize it, what happens when they bet on that? And invariably, when people begin to tap into what feels right for them, what's true for you? That's not for anyone else to tell you. What's true. For You is a very intimate internal affair. And to give people tools to be able to tap into that, whether it's connecting with your breath or just being able to close your eyes and listen, it's developing that anchor. And then over time, we begin to leverage that more and more. And I know that's a very broad stroke answer. But it's all about feeling and listening.

Brandon Handley 45:24
No, I'm with you, right. So I want to own nail a couple of things down here, right discipline. I think that if anybody goes and I look up the word, it really just means how to learn, right? Like, I mean, it's not like, you know, how do you learn? And then how do you apply that and not even like a rigorous, like, you're gonna get 30 swatches if you don't do this correctly, kind of thing. Having that develop that for yourself, right? Like they were called disciples. People, they were, you know, they were called disciples. And it's not not not too far off a discipline, right? So it's really, really about learning. I love to that you're sitting on, you know, what's true for you, intimately and truthfully. Books upstairs, you got to be your own authority, Chris, you got to be your own authority, what's inside of you, you can't have somebody else telling you what's inside of you. Right? You may, you may, you may need some work right with somebody like, especially as men, we shut everything down a certain period, we grin and bear it and we trudge forth we Sally forest, we grind them do all the weeds, all this stuff that like leaves us burnt out a certain period. Because we never paid any attention to ourselves internally, and we need to reconnect with that, right? We need to learn what these feelings are that I'm feeling, right? What is what is this that I'm feeling? Because that can be a huge frustration point to that. I'm feeling this thing. I want to know what it is. And the next closest thing that I've got to it's anger. Right, right, because I don't know what it is that I'm feeling. So I'm just gonna plop this over into anger and be angry. Right? It could be something else. So like in this huge spectrum of what feelings are. So in this whole piece of what you're talking about, too, is vulnerability, right? You've got to be willing to test that intuition. It could be a scary moment, I could be coming up to you, Chris, you could be my you know, you could be my sales leader. I'm like, Chris, you know, I'm, I'm feeling this certain way. And I'm just gonna go with I'm saying that you don't know that I'm trying to come from a place it's coming from my right shoulder is where I'm feeling this intuition. It's a vulnerability, right? Because to man, especially, that's a chink in our armor, right? Here's that chicken, the odds of my feelings right here. If he can see what my feelings are, he's gonna poke at it. Right? So but if we do that, and something good comes out of it. That becomes it becomes strength. Right? It becomes like a really just an awesome, awesome tool. So I think that that's kind of what you're sharing, right? Yeah. Yeah, awesome. So thanks for sharing that. So, Chris, what I like to do around this part is to lean into ces for like the fun part of the show, right? Somebody tuned in today. They tuned in at the beginning, they liked what she had to say about like, you know, the beginning on like, who your message, but this is a little bit like spiritual speeding, right, Chris, somebody, somebody out there is like, alright, well, depending on how he answers one of these two questions is what now I'm gonna go spend some more time with Chris. So spiritual Bachelor Number one, distraction.

Chris McCann 48:35
Greatest distraction.

The disconnect between our bodies and our higher self.

Brandon Handley 48:51
Talk a little bit more about that.

Chris McCann 48:53
This dissonance exists between what we think is true, or we want to be true and what actually is true. And we over intellectualize think too much, feel too little. thinking too much. It was a greatest distraction for me. For many people that I work with

Brandon Handley 49:12
too much in the head. Yeah. Too much too much too much up there. You know, I talk a lot about that. And just the idea, and I'm sure you've run across this yourself. But, you know, in other cultures, you know, the word for your heart and your mind is usually just one word. Right? And it's our western civilization. We've got the heart in the mind where they're separated. So it's it, we mentally have them separate, right. And so the disconnects it's not an evolution, we started, you know, we're like, oh, that's your heart. That's your mind. Right. And so I think that's an interesting one for sure. getting back in touch with body sounds like you're doing that through breathwork meditation, and even just like, hey, where do you feel that in your body?

Chris McCann 49:58
Yeah, let's name is not it. simply an auditory experience,

Brandon Handley 50:02
feeling feeling for sure. Man is current religion serving its purpose.

Chris McCann 50:10
Yes, to those that need that education. Religion is a construct that man is put around spiritual experiences. And I do believe that we select, or we select the variables that were presented in this particular lifetime and expression. And if we're meant to be dogmatic in any certain religion, or tenant or belief system, it's because there's something for us to learn. So I'll say yes. But the opportunity exists, then to prove out that that might not be true for you, which can lead to some pretty radical self inquiry and forming your own internal affairs. That to me has been the opportunity.

Brandon Handley 50:57
I got you I got so serving, serving a purpose. Serving Yes, for sure. For

Chris McCann 51:03
sure. Maybe, maybe not the highest purpose but a purpose

Brandon Handley 51:06
pay? For sure. For sure. I get it. I get it. Well, Chris, you know, a couple of things. Everybody, I want to make sure that, you know, Chris does does looks like you do some awesome work with men as well. You do some men's group, at least men's groups. I loved having this conversation a little bit. We touched on that. men's groups as well. You do speaking engagements, it sounds like you're facilitate trying to get businesses closely aligned with purpose. Intent, right, and being aligned and really engaging their workers. Right. Yeah. And what else? What is? Yeah, what else? Would you let want to make sure people know that? Who should be connecting with you? Right?

Chris McCann 51:46
Yeah, you know, and it's a lot of organizations are just like people, right? They're organisms. And I think of content stack, you know, where I am today is it's a movement, and it's not an organization. And, you know, it's when you have so many people involved, it takes on an energy to itself, but oftentimes organizations, even though there may be noble one thoughts, they can often be weakened execution, they lose sight of their original intent with the founders original purposes. And for me, and when I work with organizations like that, you know, it's just, again, it's helping this entity or this organism, remember who they are, and then aligning the people that are there to that mission, but the mission first than the team, and then it's you, the employee, or you the CEO. So organizations that feel like perhaps they've lost a sense of themselves, or want to perhaps create, I mean, that sounds altruistic, but perhaps a way for people to feel more empowered and invested in something bigger than the company. There's an invitation for them to reach out to me there. And I just love helping guys like guys that have grinded, they've done everything right. So at least at the beginning, they were told was right. And yet, somehow they get to this place where it's like, Fuck, I thought I arrived at a miserable. Yeah. And I can, and I love helping as well.

Brandon Handley 53:12
That's awesome. Christina, where should people go to find out more about you?

Chris McCann 53:15
Just go to the website. It's Chris McCann, ch, RI S, M C, C, A. N n.cl. There's a Contact Me page there. And my myself and my team of myself will gladly respond and you set a time to talk.

Brandon Handley 53:30
Awesome. Thanks for being on today.

Chris McCann 53:31
Thanks for having me. It was a real pleasure. Absolutely. I

Unknown Speaker 53:37
really hope you enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dove podcast. Stay connected with us directly through spiritual dove.co. You can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual and Instagram at spiritual underscore go. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email there, Brandon at spiritual dove.co And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This includes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don't forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time, be kind to yourself and trust your intuition.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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