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Published: March 21, 2021, 10:20 a.m.

I am very happy to be able to share this candid conversation on Mediumship with you today as I interview a good friend, Deb Levine.

Please check out her website when you get the chance over at https://www.thesoulwisdom.com/

Brandon Handley 0:00
4321 Hey, there's spiritual dope. We are on today with my friend, Deb Razar. And Deb, I don't know if I've ever told you this, but um, you're one of the main reasons actually, that I am doing this podcast, you were a kind of a catalyst for, you know, help me get the leap into spiritual dope, I'm just gonna let you know that just by doing kind of what you did, I said, that was a friend of mags from way back in the day, like childhood days, she's an evidential, medium, and intuitive. She, you know, she helps people kind of like, connect with their loved ones who have passed. And I'm just kind of reading your bio off right now. And you know, you know, your calling is to serve the spirit world while bringing hopeful, helpful and healing messages. To me, you, your loved ones in the physical world. No, but your medium, right. And like it took you a while to just kind of accept your gifts. Right? And, you know, when you would share this coming out letter magazine, or virtually coming out letter, what's this going to be about?

Deb Levine 1:09
Well, she told me what she thought it was about.

Unknown Speaker 1:11
Now, it's not that

Deb Levine 1:13
there's anything wrong with that, but it's not bad,

Brandon Handley 1:15
per se. So this coming out letter was like, you know, I'm a medium coming out letter. And I thought that was a I thought that was kind of an entertaining thing. And then you had given me a reading that connected me with my grandfather. And, you know, the catalyst, just just so you know. He knows like, Yeah, I was like, well, you're kind of like stepping out and doing this thing. And I was like, What the hell am I holding myself back for? Right? I was like, I was like, the time is now. And, you know, just kind of stepping into it. So you know, I want a quick, I'm gonna start this off with a thank you, you know, for helping be the catalyst inspiration and a part of the journey. So thank you,

Deb Razar 1:51
You're quite welcome. Happy I could be a part of that.

Brandon Handley 1:54
And, and then I always start us off with something, this would be an easy one for you. I always start these off with, you know, source, as you know, divine energy speaks through us, right. And we are here to get today to speak to somebody who's listening in on this podcast, right? And there's a there's a message that can only be delivered right now, through you to that person, what is that message today?

Deb Razar 2:19
The biggest, the first thing that comes to me is to really trust in yourself. If you don't, first and foremost trust in yourself, especially in the field that I hate saying the field that I'm in, but with what I do, it's impossible for me to trust in what I'm, you know, hearing subjectively, from the spirit world. And the most important thing, when I say to trust yourself, it's to really, you know, they say there's intuition, gut instinct, but it's really to trust your soul to trust what your soul is telling you. Because that's where all of the answers are, it's not going to come from anything external. It's not going to come from anybody else, you can ask for 50 opinions from 50 friends and family members. And really, ultimately, what matters is that you trust what your soul is telling you. That's probably my biggest message.

Brandon Handley 3:06
So where do you feel like you You? First, finally learned to trust that for yourself?

Deb Levine 3:14
Well, it was definitely not an overnight thing, as I'm sure you know, because I know that you've done a lot of, I call it self development work. And I think we're all works in progress. And I'm not done, I'll never be done. I mean, until the day I physically leave this earth. But this was a long journey. For me, really, I say, on my website, sort of back to myself. Because the way I'm living now is very true to me, and very authentically, but it wasn't always like that. So I think it was a process of really coming. I don't I would say, coming to terms with but understanding that there's a real duality to me to each of us. And there's, you know, there are a lot of things that we don't particularly care about ourselves, we, you know, traits that, Oh, I wish I wasn't so stubborn, or I wish I wasn't so, so messy in my case. And there were these qualities that I have that I would really shame myself for a variety of things you would a podcast isn't long enough for me to tell you what I used to shame myself for. And then they're there. The other part of that duality are the things that I'm proud of the parts of my personality that that I really feel good about that the things that I'm not afraid for others to see. I feel like a lot of us walk around and, and we show one side of us, we show the side that we think is safe, because we all just want to be seen. But yet if you think about it, we're not truly being seen if we don't really show who we are at the soul level, so I can show you something and make myself look good. And yeah, look at my kids. They're all perfectly dressed. And my house is so neat, which it's not this is just an example, but that may be what I'm presenting, but that may not be what is authentically me. And that was my that was my journey. If you will, that I needed to reconcile the fact that there were all these things that I really wasn't happy with with myself. And instead of complaining about it, and or shaming myself about it, I realized I was the problem, but I was also the solution. And so in order to do something about it, I had to take that journey inward, which no one likes to do, because it is quite honestly the most uncomfortable journey ever. And that's the journey back into ourselves. And it sounds super cheesy, but it's, it's really the truth, I had to come back to myself. And sort of, it's almost like, if you picture like a big toy box, you open a toy box, and you kind of take everything out, you want to see what's in there, I had to kind of assess and look at everything and say, Okay, these are the things that really aren't working for me, or these are the things that, you know, they're just sort of inherently a part of my nature. And I'm not in love with him. And I don't love other people seeing them. But it was a matter of really accepting those things about myself forgiving myself for the things that the things that I wasn't super jazzed about, but also realizing that all of those things that were more, I call them the shadow side. They were also there to teach me a lot of great lessons. And without them, you know, I wouldn't really be able to focus on the light those qualities that were really helping me be my best self, they have to coexist, they can't be mutually exclusive, because that is what makes up is my perspective only but that's what makes up the soul. Both of those the balance that duality. And so that was my,

Brandon Handley 6:38
yeah, I'm with you. Right, the so I've got that jotted down for one second. You know what, I think that I don't do the best job of this part. Right? Let's let's do let's do a real quick from your from your mouth, right? Like you're doing a medium, you are medium. Now, I'm a little bit more about kind of what you're doing in this space, right, just so people kind of get an idea of your spiritual journey and spot right now.

Deb Levine 7:08
Well, thank you for asking that. Because I think a lot of people and as you said, I'm a medium I I'm able to connect with people that have passed, is that the only thing I do not remotely, in fact, it's a very tiny part of what my mediumship is. Now, if you have 10 different mediums on your podcast, we are not all going to work the same way. Now what we what we all will work with is energy, every medium will tell you that. However, there are mediums that will be very, very factual, they'll be able to sit and I'll be able to tell you things about your grandfather, they'll name 30 facts, you know, he was an atheist, and he you know, worked in a in a shipyard and all these things and, and that is to prove that that life exists once the there is the death of the physical body. So am I able to provide evidence that our loved ones still exist? past the death of the physical body? Yes, I am. But what my sessions are really about I had one client tell me it was almost like I held a mirror to her soul. I was like, Wow, that's really deep. I almost call it like a very gentle soul excavation, if you will. Because what I'm doing is I work intuitively, if as much if not more, so then I'm working with spirit loved ones. And this has probably changed a lot. And I don't I can't remember our reading to be quite honest. But I feel like there may have been a mix, but now it's even more. So when I'm reading a client intuitively, I'm telling them about their personality and things about their life. Yeah, you could say well, why would someone want to pay to be told things they already know about themselves. But that's just how we start then we go deeper. And and I like to say I am not a fortune teller. I do not predict anyone's future. That's not what any medium really should be doing ethically and morally, we don't know what holds for people's future because there is freewill. You have the choice to make about your own life. But what I am able to do is to go deeper beneath your subconscious and sort of when I say excavate, gently pull out things that you are aware of, on some level, but on a deeper soul level when I'm showing them to you when I'm holding up that mirror. It's taken in a much different way. I'm almost I'm I feel like a session with me can help bring someone back to themselves. I'm not doing any healing. I'm not healing people. I'm not you know, waving some kind of crystal wand. That's that's not my job. That's not what I do. But with the spirit world facilitating with loved ones in spirit shining in now I talk about the loved ones personalities and the relationship between them and my client. And the healing that can take place when dad in spirit is talking about his personality and maybe challenges that he had when he was alive in the physical world. And dad son is facing something similar. It's almost like this light bulb goes off that the messages that the loved ones in spirit are bringing to my client are those in that moment that are meant for my clients greatest good and soul's highest purpose. And there's a lot of growth and a lot of shift that can happen. It's also I have on my website, I will not see clients unless there's been six months in between each reading. Because look just like when you go to therapy, you're not going to change overnight. I'm not a therapist, I'm not certified in any of that kind of thing. But even with a with a with a session with a medium like myself, what I'm presenting you is going to sit with you for a bit, and it's going to cause you to sort of, you know, there's a lot of self reflection that happens afterwards, there's a lot of there is a lot of healing that can take place. But the healing is on the part of my client, I can't do that work for someone. And maybe the client says, alright, well, that was okay. I'll just take that for what it's worth. And, and I may never hear from them again, I tend to have a lot of repeat clients. After six months, I always say six months to a year. And I just had I can think of three women I've had over the past week and a half. When they came on the screen on the zoom screen there, I could feel their energy had changed so much, it's the best feeling for what I do, because I get so excited for them. Just the wholeness that I felt from them the shift, what they were emanating, I could feel that. And that's the power of the work that that I have been called to do. And that I feel so grateful to do because the change that really can occur, it's almost like I was given this blessing of having this torch, and we all have torches, right but some of us our lights gone dim a little bit, some of us the lights gone out, if I can just assist and help someone like their torch, it's their job to keep that torch going, it's not going to be my job. But the fact that I can help light someone back up again, there's nothing greater to be able to offer to people. So that's kind of in a long way. That's kind of what I do at spirit communication. It's intuitive work, it's all combined to help my client get to a deeper part of themselves. Really.

Brandon Handley 12:10
Wow, that's awesome, right? It's kind of interesting, right? You said you started off with you know, how every medium is a little bit different. And in the image that came to my mind is you know, you just simply different lenses, right, simply different lenses, different perspectives different, you know, I'm thinking of like crystals and prisms even like different ways of refracting that energy. Right? So different way different ways of kind of refracting that love to the, you know, a mirror to the soul. And I think that that's, you know, I don't I don't the term lightworkers not not my jam, but I guess this as close as I can get right.

Deb Razar 12:46
I don't use the term either. But I yeah,

Brandon Handley 12:48
does that mean you know when you're just kind of in circles and everybody's you know, doing something similar as we are we're you know, you are showing someone the light within them right themselves and helping to extract that and

Deb Levine 13:01
everybody has it. And I believe me, I know from experience, there are times when it is so hard to find that within yourself I have the reason I this all came smack dab in my face there were there were always I mean, this is who I've been since I've been a little kid. But the reason that this came out, as it did was because of the the difficulties that I had in the work I was doing with myself that there were serious anxiety and stresses and, and that brought me to where I am currently.

Brandon Handley 13:34
I think what's interesting, too, right? A big part of what you're talking about is, you know, you you you shoved your light down for so long, right and you you shoved your own light down so long. And then you talk about doing this shadow Shadow Work. And what's funny is the more the more I think about the Disney Peter Pan, you know, the more the more I realized that like you know, you know how we lost a shadow. And then so back on like, I'm like, oh, wow, that was pretty potent stuff. Yeah. All right. But the idea of going back in and and accepting all of who you are, allows you to bring that authentic self that you're talking about come out and share exactly who you are with everybody else and just kind of like it's a it's a more powerful but gentler way of being I would agree right? Um, and I also love the idea of like you know, once one you know so one session with you is basically a six month to a year value, right? It's kind of I mean, you know, you know it to spend like you know value into that but that's kind of what it is and then you bring it you know how and that's how we open it up right like you helped me kind of bring me back to myself through the connection with my kind of grandfather and and by showing that like you know, you can just stop into who you are, and just go do your hell with it. I mean, what's gonna happen? Right, exactly right. Yeah. And so you know, lots of stuff packed in there. And then you talk about, like, you know, the shift in energy. But I'd like to hear you kind of, again, where? Before you were doing media, and I don't actually, I actually don't know. So before you were doing medium work, what kind of work were you doing, like what was, you know, kind of paint the picture before stepping into that, and then illustrate maybe your shift and acceptance of who you are.

Deb Levine 15:32
Okay. So before all this, I mean, and I still am, I, I'm a mom. And I used to say, I'm just a mom. And now I've scribbled that word, just out with black sharpie, because that is, you know, from from parenting there, there's never it's not just a mom or just a dad, even I mean, it's a parenting is, you know, and, and I parent with my full self, and I try to be as present as I can with my kids. My background, and where Meg and I went to college. My background is in advertising and public relations, I was always into creative writing, I really thought it'd be cool to be the next Amanda Woodward. Because you know, we were all into Melrose Place back then not that that'll date me. But that was not a really practical thing, because you had to, you know, move to New York or LA, which I wasn't prepared to do at the time. So I fled my East Coast roots and and came out to Arizona, and I ended up working in radio for about four and a half years. And I was on the sales side of things. So I was in advertising technically, but I was on the sales side of things. And my managers, this is funny, I two nicknames I was called at this is great at 23. Everyone would love to be called This Old Mother Hubbard. And I was called everyone's conscience. I didn't know whether or not to take that as an insult or a compliment. It's just kind of funny. Now looking back on what I do, there was there was a lot of CD stuff happening in radio, a lot of my older men cheating. And it was just it was icky. And so here I was the young one in the group, I was one of the youngest. And they thought of me as their conscience, which I laugh now it sort of makes sense a bit. Not that I was an angel by any means. But it's just kind of funny thinking about that. And then, you know, I wasn't happy with what I did. In fact, I was I was the George Costanza of my office, my sister used to crack up because I would act all stress, and I have these deadlines, but I was really going into the coffee room because there was a copy room then. And I was photocopying off of the internet recipes from Epicurious and food.com. I kid you not when I was done in radio, I hope my bosses are my own bosses aren't listening to this. I probably had a binder this thick. I've always been a cook and a baker. And baking has always been a passion. So I left radio and I went to Baking and Pastry school for a year I worked for a wholesale bakery. Then I started working for Jenny Craig, which everyone cracks up like, okay, at first, I'm making the baked goods and I'm helping people lose the weight. The takeaway from this is that I had no idea what I wanted to do. I had friends, childhood friends, people make nose, they were all successful. They worked for wall street, and they were pharmaceutical sales reps and occupational therapists, and they had these big jobs. And they made these big salaries. And I was going from job to job to job and I remember saying to my parents, I just don't want to work at a desk in an office. And my dad said, what does that mean? You want to be a plumber? And I'm like, No, I just I want to help people. And I just want to do something that feels good. And you know, I was just like living on another planet. I had no attention span for anything. Every job I was bored, instantly. pastry school I loved but I didn't love baking for somebody else. And right at the end of my reign at Jenny Craig, I was I was a program director, I did sales, I love the emotional part of that I dealt with, you know, I was overweight on and off throughout my life. So to work with people like that one on one, it really it felt like I was giving back in some way. And then at the end of that I quit a week before I had my daughter, and I haven't been back in the quote unquote, workforce, the real workforce. Um, you know, I started working for myself. So

what I realized was, I was floating around because nothing stuck with me. And you know, like a lot of people do. That doesn't mean that everybody's a medium because you can't find what you want. But I just knew that I wasn't the kind of person that cared a lot about making money, and I wish I had been is maybe I would have, you know, found some big career and stuck with it. But I always I just want to do something that you know, where I feel good about what I do, where I feel like it's really making a difference. And you know, it's so cheesy to say that because so many people say and I was young when I said it, but I would get into something. In radio, for example, they gave me the difficult clients, the ones that had were going through divorce, the ones that someone had died, I made the least amount of money I was the least paying sales rep and some of these sales reps made well into the six figures. I was making nothing but I've been on the phone for hours with my clients and oh, they're breaking up with the boyfriend. They're going to talk to Deb and we'll get another deal out of it because they trusted me My strength I suck at sales. I hate asking people for money. It's so uncomfortable for me. But what I don't second is relating to people. I've always always always related with people my first job when I moved to Arizona three weeks I work for enterprise rent a car. Sorry, enterprise rent a car. crappiest job I've ever had will pick you up. You know, that was the phrase. And here I am. It's 115 in Arizona. If forget about the dry heat, it's freaking hot. And I'm wearing I had to wear a suit with pantyhose. No laughs It was so awful. I was sweating. But the people I picked up by the end, they became my friends to the point where after three weeks, the last lady I picked up. She said, You're here this dynamic personality, what are you doing driving for enterprise, she said, We need someone in our events marketing. Here's my card, call me I'm gonna get you an interview. And I thought, well, she's not going to remember she did. And a week later, I was working for her company as an event planner. So I just kept jumping job to job to job The only thing consistent was that I love relating to people. I've always loved it. So it makes sense. My medium should make sense because not only my relating to my clients, but I'm also relating to their loved ones in spirit who are still people just people not in the physical sense. So they have stories to tell. Yeah.

Brandon Handley 21:15
Not non corporeal presence, right? Yeah. Yeah. So So. Right, I love I love that, you know, kind of hopping around, nothing kind of fits. I love the idea of the and I love cooking too. And here's how I relate to kind of being in the kitchen. You're, you're connected to like a creative source. And that's for sure you're in the creation process during Yeah, so you're, you're, you have to be all in. Yeah, when you're cooking, because otherwise it falls apart. Right. So you have to pay attention. That's one of the things I haven't cooked in a while. And I've kind of missed that, because of that. So, you know, when is the point where, you know, accept the shift into your medium, ship your gifts and say, You know what, it's now's the time to make a go of this thing.

Deb Levine 22:10
You know, it was kind of like the I often I think a lot of people have to get to what, you know, they call it the dark night of the soul. It's so dramatic. But I never know what that meant, until I really felt like I was there. And I say that, obviously, with the caveat that that's different for everyone. I mean, there are people that have really lived through severe tragedy. I have not lived through any kind of tragedy like that. But for my own world, what I was dealing with my anxiety, which I've had since I was a little kid, which what's fascinating is and all of these mediumship courses and workshops and and groups that I'm I've been in and still a part of, I don't know that I've met one medium that has not had anxiety or or does not have, you know, chronic anxiety. Whether it's social anxiety, whether it's because when you're feeling all of the emotions, and you have other people and what I didn't know how to deal with energy. At that time, I didn't know that I didn't need to take on everyone's energy that was around me in a room. And why was I feeling so sad? Why am I depressed? I didn't realize that I was picking that up from, you know, someone in my college class that I was sitting next to all the time. I didn't have knowledge of that then. But what happened was, it really all came to a head for me when my grandmother who was one of my dearest friends, she died at 102. And I felt her Well, I mean, there were a lot of things that have been building up to it. But my anxiety had taken on legs right around the time when she died. And after she died. It was to the point where it didn't just feel like regular anxiety anymore. So I've been in and out of therapy for years. Just you know, because it's been very helpful. I've had a sister that's been ill. So I was always in therapy for one thing or another. And my therapist who I really love and trust, my anxiety was just an awesome I remember her telling me She's like, yep, I was like, there's a mile a minute and she's like, just take a pause and breathe. And she made me take a couple breaths just to kind of slow down and she said while I'm breathing, she's running around behind me and her filing cabinet and she pulls out this like pamphlet of paper stapled in the corner. And she hands it to me and she starts talking and I'm not really listening to her because I can never do two things at once and this kind of explained why and I'm going through it I didn't even read the top I just there were all these questions and asked you to rate yourself on a zero meaning on the low end to a to attend. And everything was an eight or a nine there. Oh, I can't I can't remember I'm having a heart You know, having a hard time finishing a project or getting sidetracked very easily like it when someone's talking to you not being able to focus or or becoming too focused spending too much time on one thing. And I'm like, Well, I'm like, Why are you giving me and we know I have anxiety? And and then she said, That's not an assessment for anxiety. It's an assessment for ADHD. And I was like,

Unknown Speaker 25:11
What are you talking about? Well is

Deb Levine 25:12
ADHD? I mean, I would have like that's something that kids have, you know, when it well come to find out that one of the most Miss diagnosed group of people with ADHD are women in their mid 40s. Because what happens is forgetfulness, that was nothing like memory, that can be hormones, you know, perimenopausal which I am not sorry for the TMI, but it can be hormones, it can be all these things. And interestingly enough, anxiety is a, what's the word I want? is a culprit if you will have ADHD. So it's almost like what comes first the chicken or the egg, the anxiety happens because of the attention deficit, hyper focus disorder. So in children, that h is hyperactive, in adults, it's height for me, it's hyper focus. So I was I was going to bed at four o'clock in the morning. Okay, I'm on my laptop, because I'd seen a woman This is a true story with a cute pair of shoes. And I said, Where do you find them? I don't know. I got them six years ago. Oh, damned if I wasn't gonna find that pair of shoes. I can tell you. I'm online. I'm gonna find those shoes. Meanwhile, I've got the Real Housewives of some city on TV. I'm eating chocolate constantly eating chocolate because I had a problem with sugar. I could not get enough sugar. Well, then it was explained. Of course, you couldn't get enough sugar, because what your brain is missing is that serotonin release. And that's what sugar gives you. My other love. In addition to baking and eating chocolate is exercise and fitness. I've been into weightlifting. Since I was 17 and intense workouts. I was into CrossFit. All that. Well. That's another thing that's going to produce the serotonin and the dopamine release in my brain. So all of a sudden, everything sort of started to make sense. Now, I don't like to use this as Oh, well, I have ADHD. So my house is a mess. I mean, my house is a mess. And maybe it's partly my ADHD maybe it's just because I didn't feel like cleaning it. But what I want people to know and I was in I think, you know, I was in a documentary on Amazon Prime with with one of my mentors amazing medium Suzanne Wilson. She's known as the carefree medium

Brandon Handley 27:17
with the documentary.

Deb Levine 27:19
It the series is called life to afterlife by Craig McMahon is the producer. And there's there's several in that series and the one I'm in I hate the title, though. Sorry, Craig. It's really cringy it's, I want to speak to the dead. It's a little sensationalized, because it's not like that the documentary is not like that. I did not set out because I wanted to try to speak to the dead. I couldn't help it. So I'm just tossing that out there. But

Brandon Handley 27:43
real quick, one of the things that I that I find interesting, right is this relationship to the anxiety and the energy field and the mediums and it's interesting how you kind of tell tell it is, you know, you weren't aware of a way to kind of grab hold of the energy, protect yourself and redirect the energy that was coming through you. Right, right. And I hate to do that, but I always liken it to like, these, like old kung fu master flicks, right. You know, or even like, you know, the, you know, you know, the teacher will appear when the student is ready.

Deb Razar 28:18
I love that. I

Brandon Handley 28:18
love that. But it so happens, right? So, so happens, then you My guess is at some point, you know, you run into a teacher, you have some conversations, and you're like, how do you know so much about what I'm going through? Yep. Tell me exactly. Yeah, tell me.

Deb Levine 28:36
So what I was going to tell you about about the the documentary, The reason I brought it up is because when Suzanne approached me to participate in it, I said to myself, I'm going to do this, but I'm going to make sure that everything I say is my truth. And then I'm completely authentic. Craig did a great job with the with the editing, because on my hands, I'm all over the place that you know, I'm affiliate girl, that's how we talk with our hands. But I did speak about my ADHD on there, and I would I had some people that's Oh, you don't want to divulge that and people are gonna judge you. Number one, I'm not concerned about being judged anymore at all. And that that is a true statement.

Brandon Handley 29:15
And that's what I mean, right? Like, I mean, how liberating is

Deb Levine 29:18
so liberating. You don't? I mean, it's amazing. But more importantly, I needed to speak my truth. Because if one person heard me and felt like this, again, everything I say feel like is so cliche, but if I can help one person, but it's true, and I've actually had so many people reach out to me randomly on Facebook Messenger saying, I really connected to you, because I also you know, I thought that I was just really unmotivated or really lazy or and it doesn't mean that every person that reached out to me feels like they're a medium. This is only a part of my own personal journey. But I it upsets me that there is a stigma and for children as well. This is something that never popped up in My, in my childhood, maybe it was there in subtle ways. I mean, I was a good student, but I had to, like I had to be in a room with no noise. Like I had friends who could study with music on and talking, I needed to total quiet otherwise my mind was listening and taking in everything around me. But I also need to express that I don't define myself like, Oh, I'm an adult with ADHD, it's one little bit of me and I actually have a mentor that thinks that I really may not have it, that it might be just sort of all the other things in my life that that were were big stressors. And maybe that's true, too, you know,

Brandon Handley 30:37
so so here's the thing that, you know, I'll you know, if you don't mind, I'll share my take on this now, right. Like, I mean, we were raised to be distracted. I mean, look at all the different courses, I mean, that we had to take, right look at, you know, the television programming, 20 minute blocks, you know, or 10 to 15 minute blocks, and then, you know, six minutes of 32nd commercials, we were trained to be fucking confused and D rains. Right. And so here's the result. And, and, you know, so the reason, my reason for saying that, you know, you don't have an attention to or like you're hyper active or whatever deficit because that's, it worked. The training worked, which is which is which is, you know, which brings us back to, you know, reconnecting with yourself, which is what you've done,

Deb Levine 31:28
and you literally just touched on something because as you were saying that he like this light bulb bulb went off and it was gonna bring me back around to the point where you use the word distracting, like there have always been so many distractions. And for me, what my distractions were whether they were connected to ADHD or not, I needed at that heightened point of anxiety I needed my distractions where I've never been a drinker. It's chocolate lit like food, it specifically sweets, and I would binge on chocolate, and then I would go into a shame spiral about it. But what the chocolate was doing I was numbing everything I did the online shopping the watching too much reality TV, having it all at once. It was a way to quiet the noise. Now remember, I'm a medium. So there was all this noise, this energy coming from everywhere. Think about it. How is that going to? How is that going to silence it? I didn't know what I was dealing with. So I use every external source it's a good thing. I don't like alcohol and I've never been into drugs because I probably would be you know in a right now. I'm not making fun of that. But I'm being serious.

Brandon Handley 32:31
No, that'd be a definitely be. Just another another thing to pile on top. Yeah. Did you ever try a foil helmet?

Deb Razar 32:43
Or being here is

Brandon Handley 32:44
semi facetious, right, like but I mean, if you if you you know the Gerrish I put on like a foil helmet to stop, like, all the noises right now. And when I don't, okay, you know, like, I mean, honestly, like, I mean, if, like, you know, if, again, if I'm, if I'm having all these things happen, I'm just thinking, like, you know, I could see myself actually doing that at some point, especially like, if all these noises are always coming through, and I don't have a teacher, I don't have a guide. We didn't get that in fifth grade. We got, you know, we got phys ed and other things, but we didn't, we didn't we didn't we didn't train it, you know,

Deb Razar 33:15
to the disease.

Brandon Handley 33:17
You know, that wasn't an option. Right. All right. So so i would i would literally probably see myself putting putting try trying it right. How do I how do I quiet it?

Deb Levine 33:26
Well, here's the thing is that when I say all the noise and the distraction at this particular time, it was I wasn't hearing from spirit people. I it was, it was the energy, it was the emotion it was I was like a sponge. And it's a lot to be a sponge for everybody else. And I've been this way since I was a little kid, if if someone in my family was having a bad day, I was feeling the bad day, which is probably why I ended up in therapy. Each time my sister had cancer, she never complained. She was a warrior. But I is like, I wanted to take all of that on. And I think in a way energetically I did and and so I was, you know, super, super low. And look, there's always going to be stuff, there's always going to be stuff happening around. when I really started hearing from the spirit world when I say that now there are mediums that hear objectively, meaning, you know, oh, I hear voices in my head. I don't hear voices in my head. Just to clarify, and I'm not saying this to joke because they're mediums that objectively hear like your grandfather in the spirit world. They might say like, I see your grandfather behind your right shoulder. That is not how it's come for me. Now. The beauty of mediumship is that it's a self development journey. It's always changing always. So may I eventually at some point, see someone's loved one sitting next to them. I may but as of right now, the way I say it is it's like a picture in my mind's eye if I asked you right now, to remember your favorite scenes from your favorite movie, and like play it in your mind like it's a real you could see right you could see the people what they're doing. You could even hear your favorite line even though you're not hearing it being played in your ear. So when I explain that I see an eye here that is subjectively, okay, that's really important. So it wasn't that I was I was being bombarded by like, Hey, can you get a hold of my nephew? And hey, can you get a hold of my daughter of it? Because that would that would really drive someone crazy probably. And there is a huge stigma that we're all nuts, right? I mean, it was like, you know, I should have come on with the headscarf and, and the others patolli everywhere around me and I just burned my Sage actually did burn a little sage, I do like sage. And there's nothing wrong with petroleum headscarves, and all those things. But the point is, and yes, I'm holding a crystal because my holy and crystal grounds me like I tend to be like very up here. And so it grounds me whenever I am, whenever I need to discuss or when I'm in a reading I typically will hold will hold some form of stone. But there is no one size fits all for mediums. I mean, a lot of people think of mediums they think of the Long Island medium, Theresa Caputo, she's a character with the long nails and she's got like a stick I call it she got the blonde hair and

Unknown Speaker 36:00
but

Deb Levine 36:00
the sad thing is, that probably detracts from the fact that she really does, you know, hear from people's loved ones. But there's not a one size fits all, we don't all look a certain way, if you saw me on the street, you just feel like, oh, there's some, you know, middle aged woman with two kids and you know, living her life. It's not like, you know, my walk around, like with this, and I have, you know, scarves all around me, I just think there, there are lots of stigmas. You know, my add was a soup, I feel like I had to sort of rebel against all the stigmas, if you will, especially now.

Brandon Handley 36:31
Well, I mean, again, you just had to, you had to go in, see who you were for yourself, and make the decision to accept yourself as you are for who you are, and roll with it. Right? Yeah, kind of step into that and, and share yourself with others, which is we know, kind of what you're doing with the soul wisdom, right on your website is what you're doing with offering readings. And so that was a big part of this podcast is, you know, talk about, I guess, you know, kind of merging all of who you are your spiritual self with the material world writer, you know, bringing that out, like, I mean, one of the one of the other things that you hit on too is like, you know, we've got these two separate selves. And I always think of like, you know, the matrix, right, there's, you know, Mr. Neo, you one life, you're blah, blah, blah, this one guy and this other person, and that's so true. Right? So how do you, you know, how do you feel like you have merged the two? And, you know, what's your life been like, because of that.

Deb Razar 37:38
So when you say, how have I merged my mediumship? With now that, that it's a technically a business as well? Yeah,

Brandon Handley 37:45
sure. Sure. Well, I mean, right. But that's, but that's also just, that's another stigma, right? Like, that's just something that you don't want to because you're like, this is helping people category, right? You don't want to you don't want to, like be like, but it is right. It's just, and it's just, it's, again, we wanted to we just want to be ourselves, right? Without, right without classify or label it. But like, exactly those labels, unfortunately, hopefully, other people what. It's hard, it's hard to put yourself on the map if you don't share the map.

Deb Levine 38:17
It's true. It's true. And I, I think what had to happen for me was that once I really decided, and it wasn't choice that I was going to live, to really live my authentic truth in every facet of my life. You know, I have a mentor that says mediumship is not spirit communication, or just intuitive mediumship is, is, is our life. I mean, being a medium is being alive. And being alive means being, if, if I really want to do my soul's work, as a natural medium, I have to work my mediumship the way I work my life. And what I've decided to do, again, this is just I'm one person, you could ask 10 different mediums, they'd say different things, I have to show up every day, as myself, again, I said flaws and all that, that whole duality, because what I'm able to do then is is hopefully, especially in a session with me, allow other people to see that it's okay to show up as yourself. You don't have to be X, Y or Z to be enough. And again, everything I say is written in every book everywhere. You know, we are enough as we as we are and I you know, I used to hear they go oh yeah, I'm enough as I am, whatever. But if I were only skinnier and apparently had more, you know, this that

Brandon Handley 39:38
shirt No, you're right, right. It is all in these books. And it is a number of these things. But it's a it's a different level of understanding. right there's, there's there's the literal understanding, and there's the outward facing physical application of this shit, right? You're like, Oh, I'm enough. Yeah, I showed up for work and I sharpen 72 pencils, whatever. Right, I'm going off gay, but like, you're the I'm enough is like, you know, that's the inner work that you're talking about it most

Deb Razar 40:07
important work,

Brandon Handley 40:08
right? It's it's the, you know, the, the, you know, the most neglected. Right. Yeah, yeah. And then and then different levels of understanding, right? Because not for nothing, you know, four years ago, you know, if you'd said that this is what I'd be doing or any of this stuff, I would have laughed at you.

Deb Razar 40:27
Me to me? Yeah, yeah, I get that. So, go ahead. No, I

Brandon Handley 40:32
mean, just I mean, that's, it sounds cliche, right, only because it's real, unless you've experienced it subjectively, because you cannot, unfortunately, have somebody else's experiences for them, like you were talking about earlier. You know, you can't do the work for somebody else. Now. You can't show up inside of someone else for them.

Deb Levine 40:57
Now, you can. No, but what I think what I think did it for me, you know, when I first like when I could not turn off the gifts when I was getting all this information about people that had passed, for people that I even like sort of knew, but didn't really No, I mean, it's it's funny, and Magnus is, I've gotten in touch with some some people that I've known since childhood that we've known since childhood, because their loved ones came to me and I, I was pretty proud of myself for having the coneys to reach out and say, Look, I know I haven't seen you in 2030 years. But hey, I'm able to communicate with the dead and I've got your wife or your dad or whomever with me, that for me, took not staying small anymore, because oh no, what are they gonna think they're gonna think I'm weird. I didn't care. I didn't care what they thought, because if I knew that their loved ones had an important message for them to receive. Now this is before i was i was i really sort of had honed what I'm doing because there is ethics and morals. Although we don't take the Hippocratic oath. We don't. We're not therapists, we're not doctors, but it is so critical to have ethics and morals in in what I do. Because people are trusting me. I mean, when you when you have a session with me, it's almost like I say like, you know, you can try to bullshit your therapist. I've tried that once or twice. And we want to sort of show our therapist like the good side, which you can't get help that way. But still, it's been done, people kind of try to BS, the therapist, when you're coming with me, it's almost like we're now we've now been, it's like having seen your therapist for seven years. Because all of a sudden Our relationship is like boom, because you can't, you're not going to be able to, to show me something that isn't true, because I am an intuitive. So I'm going to know that it's not true. Now I also my job is also to tread lightly. If I know that someone, someone can't take the information that I'm about to give that, or they're not ready to hear it.

Unknown Speaker 42:48
Hi, buddy.

Deb Levine 42:49
How are you? It's so good to see you. I got to chat with him after. If I am. My job as the medium is to be able to gauge whether or not my client is really ready for this gentle soul excavation, I will never force on someone shoved that mirror up to your face. That's the job of the medium. And there can be ego involved. And there is is zero place. I had a mentor say the first two letters and medium don't belong there. Because this is not about me, this is not like a look at the pony trick I can do. I'm not doing anything I am being I am being my authentic self, the channel, if you will. I'm a conduit as a better word for it. And my job is to be open to not impose any judgment to not impose any meaning. And to listen to what the loved ones in spirit have to say, to make sure that my client receives what they need. When I first started this when I first started my development, I was so excited about my own experience. This is so cool. Oh my god, that guy just told me where his ashes were. And the wife just said, No one knows that. And was I patting myself on the back. But no, but I was like, This is the coolest thing ever. Oh my gosh, how is this happening? But guess what the experience is not for me. It's not about me, I have nothing to do with this. Once I got over that that initial excitement. It's why my mediumship changed. It's why my my sessions are not merely spirit, contact communication, where I'm just giving a lot of evidence. Because what happened was when I really went in and did that soul work on myself, when I really learned to accept being in my truth. I could then accept this the truth of the Spirit people had for their loved ones. And I could help then my client discover if they hadn't already their own truth. That's the only way it's that triad of energy. And that was when it almost came full circle. It wasn't just like, this is so awesome. I'm talking to people that aren't alive anymore. But yet I knew all these things. That's not what this is about. This is so much deeper and there can be so much healing and soul work done. A medium ship session, if your listeners take nothing away, it is not just spirit communication it can be. And if you are, if you have a loved one that you're really hoping to hear from, I, the medium has no control over that the spirit world knows what my client needs. In that moment, as I said, for their soul's highest purpose and greatest good, they know, it's only going to be hopeful, helpful or healing, there's nothing else that it's not dark or fearful. I don't there's no fear around what I do I have the utmost respect for this

Brandon Handley 45:31
calling, if you will. So I mean, it's almost not almost I mean, you are tuning into that connection as a medium for your clients to, you know, pull that in through the universe. And, you know, if you've got your ego involved with it, there's it's almost like you're attaining the water or near the source, right? And then, as you do this mediumship connecting the source, you know, and and, you know, translating it right into words, for for, for for the person who's there, your client, essentially, you're reconnecting them the source, right?

Deb Razar 46:12
It Well, except, if you look at it this way, again, just my perspective. We all have the connection to source because it's within us, right? Yeah. So if they've lost that connection,

Brandon Handley 46:23
it's kind of like, you know, I don't know what a jumpstart right for your heart, right?

Deb Razar 46:28
jumper kit, your jumper cables for a car even? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 46:31
yeah, that's exactly,

Unknown Speaker 46:32
yeah, yeah, your batteries there. It's just like, drained or neglected, or

Deb Razar 46:36
a great way of putting it. Yeah.

Brandon Handley 46:38
Right. And so that's, I mean, that's awesome. Right. And again, the, the, the experience I had with you was, was amazing, always grateful for that. And, you know, I think, you know, I know, I was on my way as I was just doing some things that but I wasn't doing them in 100% authentic manner, and in a way that I was still masking myself, right, and what you did kind of allow me to just obliterate the mask and say, fuck, let's go for it. And

Deb Levine 47:08
that's the greatest thing I could hear, by the way from, from someone that I've worked with, because, and I've told you this before, because it's all the ripple, we all have that ability to give back you are doing, you are really doing so much good. You have that energy about you where you're so curious, you're just so open you you want people, you want an understanding, and you really get excited, and you want that understanding to be shared among other people. So the fact that I was able to kind of give you that little spark, look what you're doing now for so many other people. So that's what I love, we are really all connected. Again, I'm gonna sound super cheesy. But if we can see each other as that we're all extensions of one another and not look at each other as like, Oh, you have that I want that. And it's not about that. I mean, we really can be support for one another and be each other's cheerleader. No matter what we do, no matter what business industry calling, there's not one more special than the other what gifts someone has, when someone comes to me, if their gift is there, an electrician, and they're they're so good at and they're helping, you know, out here, let me tell you in Arizona, your AC goes out your host in the summer, right, it's 117 degrees, that someone's gift, and so long as they're living authentically, they're living their truth, they're passionate about it. If I can help spark that in other people, then as I used to say, like, I just want a job where I can help people that I really feel like I'm getting to live my very fullest life in that sense. And that is, that's really the greatest gift that I've ever been given through all the shitstorm that i've you know, kind of had to get past to get to this point. Every bit of it was worth it to be right here.

Brandon Handley 48:47
Well, you know, some people never get to that point, right? It's not about how long it takes you to get to do get there. Right. And and, you know, Meg and I certainly have the conversations where I believe that more people get there than not it's just males out there there's well there's not an understanding of where they are because of the Western you know, kind of mindset and it's like oh shit, I'm I'm gonna need like Percocet I'm gonna I'm gonna need a whatever this that whatever's going on here has got to be shoved right back let's

Deb Levine 49:19
commit let's do whatever we can let's find ways to numb it and to not to feeling the pain no one look it doesn't feel good to feel pain whether it's emotional pain or physical pain we all as human beings want that. Whenever pain starts, what can I do to stop it?

Brandon Handley 49:36
Why would you so I mean what I'm looking at those isn't isn't pain. It's that that this reignition of source and energy and feeling it kind of like you were feeling it all coming from everywhere and and not knowing what it is but since you don't know what it is being fearful of it and trying to block it all out. Right. So yeah, keeping yourself disconnected from source and

Deb Razar 50:00
Yeah.

Brandon Handley 50:01
Right. But but but simply just because of all the stigmas and all this other stuff anywho that's not what you do what you do is help people connect to that, which is already there, show them kind of like their own inner hidden city of glory or whatever right and

Deb Razar 50:18
I need you to write my website and

Brandon Handley 50:22
so you know, you help people you map it out or at least you know, show it so that it is possible and you're doing this on the soul wisdom calm. And then you know, tell us a little bit more at least know what's offered on the soul wisdom calm and is that the only place they can connect with you? Where should they go if they want to connect with you.

Deb Levine 50:42
It's vessel ism, th e Sol, s o ul wisdom, calm all one word that is the best place, there's a way to email me directly from Matt, it has my business number is on there as well. It's interesting, but as I've developed, I've whittled down my website was pretty small to begin with. And I've whittled it down because I used to have a medium ship offering a mediumship session and an in and an intuitive only session. So if someone was not interested in hearing from loved ones in spirit, they just had like, they've got life issues, they've got things on their path, they really want to get into the meat of I took that away, because what I realized was, if someone's coming to work with me, they have to have some sort of trust with me off the bat. as of lately, I mean, I don't market myself, it's all been referral. I mean, thanks for the documentary with Suzanne Wilson really was a big help. This I was on your friend, Mona Lauren's podcast. That was that was a help. But other than that, there's not really a way that people hear about me. So typically, they've heard from a friend or a loved one. So they come with sort of a sense of trust. If they're coming to me with that sense of trust, they have to trust me, but more so they have to trust the spirit world. Because I my hope is that my clients come the best way to get the most depth out of a session is to come as open as possible. Because if you're open, then you are going to receive what it is that you need, which I can't know because I don't know my clients before I work with them. They're strangers to me, we leave usually as friends, but they always start out as someone I've never met. I don't like to know anything about the people I work with. If they're open, now, I just say I offer a mediumship session a mediumship session, which is what I was saying earlier is not just talking to dead people, a mediumship session is talking to the dead but it's also intuitive information. Is it more one and less of another? It may be we never know because it's different every time could I call

Brandon Handley 52:36
it like continuation of energy instead of the dead right like I mean yes it's really I mean it's not dead

Deb Razar 52:44
Yeah, there is no there there is a there is no Yeah,

Brandon Handley 52:46
yeah so so I mean just energy continuation of my grandfather. Dead does

Deb Levine 52:53
sound It sounds very harsh. There are people that say well, dead is meaning like the physical bodies die but I call I really call them spirit people because their their spirit hasn't gone anywhere the essence of who they are that that is still very much alive. So on my website again, it's it's it's very it's slim. That's my offering. I am and I had changes to I do have I am certified in sound healing. And for a while I was offering sound healings, then COVID hit and it's possible. I've done sound healings over what do you call it Facebook Live, you know, just work like private Facebook Live groups. But I find that I use a gong and I use a crystal singing bowl and I've got a rain stick and I've got a wave drum. What I find is my sound healing is really an extension of my mediumship. So that's a whole story for another podcast but sound

Brandon Handley 53:44
so so that's I mean, that's that's a basically a part of your offering, right part of the suffering. It's

Deb Razar 53:49
not on the website anymore. I took it off.

Brandon Handley 53:51
Well, I mean, let's say that you and I are talking and intuitively. You're like you know what? You need some noise, bro.

Deb Razar 53:59
Yes, I need some noise. I gotta get that gong out for you. Yes,

Brandon Handley 54:03
no. So real quick, so I'm just gonna I'm gonna wind it down here Devin, you and I can keep talking right so everybody you know go to the soul wisdom.com checkout and see what she has offer there. My Instagram You

Deb Razar 54:16
mean to tell you that sir. Instagram is so wisdom. So wisdom easy. Yes. Thank you. Thank you for that. You

Brandon Handley 54:24
know what I was always saying like so was the MAS or something like that. But it's so wisdom a wisdom AZ so

Deb Razar 54:30
wisdom was taken so AZ I'm in Arizona, so

Brandon Handley 54:32
that's where they're not sure. Yeah, that makes sense. No, sorry to interrupt. No, you're good. You're good. So you'll connect back with it. This is something that you're more interested in. I'll have links also in the podcast notes.

Deb Razar 54:49
I appreciate you having me on. It was fun.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai