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Rukmini Callimachi covers ISIS for The New York Times and is the host of Caliphate.\n\n\u201cMy major takeaway that I have come away with in this work is go to the enemy. Talk to the enemy. I think that the way that Al Qaeda and ISIS is typically covered is by reporters who just speak to officials in Washington. ... That\u2019s only one side of the story. And I have learned so much by seeking out their documents, reading their propaganda ... speaking to them themselves.\u201d\n\n\n\nThanks to MailChimp, Read This Summer, Google Play, and Stitcher Premium for sponsoring this week's episode.\n@rcallimachi\nCallimachi on Longform\n[3:15] Longform Podcast #129: Rukmini Callimachi (February 2015)\n[3:30] Caliphate\n[8:30] The Daily\n[25:00] \u201cJustice for Our Children, Killed by ISIS\u201d (New York Times \u2022 February 2018)\n[27:45] Shoah (Claude Lanzmann \u2022 April 1985)\n[28:15] The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich (William Shirer \u2022 1960)\n[31:00] \u201cThousands of Children Work in African Gold Mines\u201d(New York Times \u2022 August 2008)\n[1:12:45] \u201cThe Looming Tower: Al Qaeda and the Road to 9/11\u201d (Lawrence Wright \u2022 2006)\nLearn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices